UB: Pre-notes for Ch 16

1. Let us take a person who has taken up study of Engineering. He has to study hard for four years till he gets his degree. The four qualities stated in Ch 15 may be taken as four years of Engineering study.
2. However, one cannot get admission in an Engineering college till one completes school and Junior college and clears an entrance exam. Similarly, one cannot get into thinking about four qualities till one develops ethical qualities and lives a moral life.

UB: 3. In line with presence of त्रिगुण, there are 3 kinds of orientations among humans. One whose सत्व is prominent is a देव, if रजस् is prominent, he is असुर and if तमस् is prominent, he is a राक्षस. In Ch 16, श्रीकृष्ण simplifies this into two kinds of people – one who possess दैवी संपत्ति and the others who possess आसुरी संपत्ति where असुर & राक्षस are merged into the आसुरी संपत्ति. Only one who has दैवी संपत्ति will even think about making अध्यात्म ज्ञान as focus of his life. An आसुरी संपत्ति one will not even consider this as an option. This reinforces what we had discussed earlier viz the morality is not an absolute but is an instrument for a higher goal. And moral prescriptions will not make sense unless one knows why one has to be moral in the first place.

UB: 4. Gita thus beautifully spends focussing on ब्रह्मज्ञान only in the first 15 chapters. Once done, morals are briefly described towards the end. It is the पुराण, इतिहास and धर्म शास्त्र which dwell much more into the nuances of धर्म and make it the focus of their narration while texts like उपनिषद्, ब्रह्मसूत्र, योग वसिष्ठ, etc dwell mainly on ब्रह्मज्ञान.

UB: 5.  One last point viz that one’s character determines the lifestyle one adopts. Equally, if one takes on a certain lifestyle, you can determine their character. Reading this chapter, one can thus learn whether our lifestyle signals whether we possess दैवी गुण or आसुरी गुण. And if the idea of oneness conveyed till Ch 15 does appear worth pursuing, one may take on to cultivate दैवी way of life (do साधना) so that it can pave the way for bringing अध्यात्म ज्ञान into our life.

UB: श्री भगवानुवाच

अभयं सत्त्वसंशुद्धिः ज्ञानयोगव्यवस्थितिः। दानं दमश्च यज्ञश्च स्वाध्यायस्तप आर्जवम्।।16.1।।

16.1 The भगवान् said – Freedom from fear (अभयं), purity of mind (सत्त्वसंशुद्धिः), steadiness in (commitment to) ज्ञान and योग (meaning practice) (ज्ञान योग व्यवस्थितिः), charity (दानं) and control of ways of external behaviour (दम:), यज्ञ (performing daily prayers or नित्यकर्म), (scriptural) study (स्वाध्याय:), austerity (तप:) and simplicity or straight forwardedness (आर्जवम्);

UB: 16:1 (1) – 1)  अभयं – We often hear some wise social scientists say that man made religion because of fear of the unknown. Here, भगवान् starts with अभयं as the first दैवी संपदा. Its meaning is self evident.

2) सत्त्वसंशुद्धिः – This refers to purity of mind where the person approaches every person or situation in a fresh manner without prejudice or excessive exuberance.

3) ज्ञानयोगव्यवस्थितिः – Such a person is always focussed on gaining ज्ञान. One must have an infectious attitude towards learning. This may happen via books or learning or improving skills like cooking, dancing, etc. To be always in a learning mode is a दैवी संपत्ति.

UB: 4) दानं – All religions extol दानं. In the तैत्तिरीय उपनिषद्, there is a wonderful valedictory address given to students as they leave their गुरुकुल which has the famous message – मातृ देवो भव, पितृ देवो भव, etc. On दानं, this instruction says – A दानं should be made with honour, a दानं should not be made with dishonour, दानं should be made according to one’s capacity, दानं should be made with modesty and दानं should be made with awe (meaning that we should be thankful to the person to whom one does दान since he has given us an opportunity to do दानं).

UB: 5) दम: – control of external organs. Eg.,  even though tempted, we do not eat sweets or even though angry, we keep an external calm outside, that is दम:.

6) यज्ञ: – Any act of worship is a यज्ञ. One may do an external कर्म like नित्यपूजा, नित्य श्लोक chanting, नित्य ध्यान, etc where one does an external कर्म of prayer to भगवान्. Or it may be an internal कर्म where every act viz eating, bathing, playing, etc are done as a यज्ञ where one does these actions not for oneself but for पुरुष within.

UB: 7) स्वाध्याय – Do नित्य अध्ययन् of अध्यात्मिक ज्ञान. Or whatever branch of study one takes on, we must have a discipline of being in touch with this ज्ञान on a regular basis all our life. If not done, one loses touch with the ज्ञान and thus loses the benefit of study done.

8) तप – Doing hard work and living a disciplined lifestyle. And if you want to have fun, ensure that you spend money that is earned by means of your own individual तप.

9) आर्जवम् – Being straight forward. Living without prejudice.

PK: Lovely 👌👍👍

PK: Loved Abhayam as the first characteristic to cultivate – agree with your statement that many folks contest that religion thrives in fear – it is true to a large extent IMO

UB: Question is – even रावण possessed अभयं and is अभयं really great? We need to be careful here. The अभयं of रावण is backed by pride, power, past achievements, etc just like a wealthy man will never have fear of going hungry on any day. So it is a “dependent” अभयं and thus not really अभयं. Equally, we may have people with positive fear – Am I hurting others with my speech? Am I taking care of my family properly? Am I imbibing ज्ञान in its right spirit? This kind of भयं is a kind of positive fear and must indeed be cultivated and will have to be seen as a दैवी quality. अभयं should not be seen as a licence of be a मुँहफट and then say that I am like this since श्रीकृष्ण said so 😀. So a positive fear is really a good thing to cultivate.

VB: Good u brought this up any type of fears.

PA: Very nice 👍👍

PA: “Surrender means to know ones own self and remain in the self” 👍👍

HB: 👌

PK: I guess our definition of fear is different – ” am I taking care of my family , etc is not what I would define as fear. Fear to me is the irrational thinking based on which folks do things they do not actually believe in cos otherwise they believe a thunderbolt will strike them dead or bring misery . Aarrogance is also not fear- it is arrogance in one’s infallibility . I am not sure I buy into positive fear – that is just normal healthy concern that maybe even one’s best effort sometimes may not be enough – that is by definition healthy. To me the Lord does say that fear is unnecessary in this journey to figure be oneself – if folks gurus worry that it can be misinterpreted I recognize that but this explanation to me is an example of dumbing down things in order to make things comfortable – I may be wrong but it’s my 2 cents anyway. Every attribute described here is specifically intentional and not arising out of fear – that is why I loved that Abhayam is the primary / first attribute . Honest introspection or vichara in the Sanskrit lingo is to me key and if one feels it is arising because of fear, one needs to shed it. The black cat crossing the road , Rahu Kalam not being suspicious etc are all examples of fear based faith

UB: Agree PK 👍🏼 – as the topic moves from देव to असुर traits, this forum should see more exciting discussions 😀. Is faith in black cat and Rahu Kalam to be regarded as “religion”? 😀

HB: What is Rahu Kalam

VN: And what about black cats… Cats are cats..🤔

UB: Black cat crossing the road superstition is what she is referring to.  Rahu Kalam is an astrology aspect

PK: Rahu Kalam definitely does come in the broad spectrum of religious practices followed Esp by Tambrams. This is I think followed in strongly by TamBram ( Tamil Brahmins- and probably other south indian brahmins as well – no one else seems to know about it 😃). My mom is quite a believer and in this instance sheds her doc persona ) 😃 Basically everyday of the week has a specific time period designated as Rahu Kalam ( the time dominated by Rahu planet ) where it is considered somewhat inauspicious – no pujas begin at this time , starting travel is discouraged etc … I refuse to remember the times of the day but in case for example we are traveling with my parents and need to leave the home during Rahu Kalam my mom has run- arounds 😃 like taking the Suitcase out of the home before Rahu Kalam etc ; she will get ready to go to temple during Rahu Kalam – it is a period of 90 min or so everyday at different times and she will try her best to workaround that time – funnily she did not worry about it when she was working/ operating . In that sense , she is prActical – now I am retired so I will follow but don’t break your head for work life like scheduled no surgeries etc 😃😃. She will never enforce for work etc but strictly enforces other times – makes for some inter sting conversations 😃😃

HB: Ok. Thanks . Nothing like this in Maharashtrian Brahmin although mom used to see days ‘ shubh’ ‘ashubh’ etc before deciding for imp events

UB: Ten more traits today

अहिंसा सत्यमक्रोधस्त्यागः शान्तिरपैशुनम्। दया भूतेष्वलोलुप्त्वं मार्दवं ह्रीरचापलम्।।16.2।।

16.2 Harmlessness (अहिंसा), truthfulness (सत्यम्), resolution of anger (अक्रोध:), renunciation (त्यागः), clarity (शान्ति:), not exposing defects of one person to another (अपैशुनम्), kindness to creatures (दया भूतेषु), absence of agitation of senses in the presence of objects (अलोलुप्त्वं), gentleness (मार्दवं), modesty (ह्री:), absence of (meaningless) restlessness (अचापलम्);

UB: 16:2 (1) अहिंसा – already covered in Ch 13:8 earlier.

2) सत्यम् – Be truthful. One must not lie. And if the सत्य is likely to make the other unhappy or angry or sad, mix up this truth with another line (s) that lessen the impact of such emotions. And if you still have to lie, do a very sincere प्रायश्चित that you had to lie owing to an exigency. But more key than an external lie is one who lies to himself about himself. Living a false external life that is not tuned with our own innate persona is a life that is worse than hell. A mind under मोह or infactuation is certainly capable of manufacturing lies and make us stray – be truthful to yourself.

3) अक्रोध: – Do not be angry or even if anger comes (which is natural), one witnesses it objectively and resolves the anger quickly rather than remaining in that mode for a long time.

UB: 4) त्यागः – living with a lifestyle that one does not own anything. When one stays in an expensive hotel, one knows that the fancy elite surroundings will not be with us all the time and hence there is no scope to get attached to hotel room even though we may love it. One who has त्यागः lives with this mindset with all objects and persons and while he engages with them fully, he is fine when these part company.

5) शान्ति: – Having a mind that is in a state of tranquil peace at all times. When a 60 year old plays cricket with 10 year old kids, he is fully tranquil about winning or losing a match. Such tranquility when engaging with the world no matter how difficult one’s state is, is the state of शान्ति

6) अपैशुनम् – Not exposing defects of one person to another.

UB: 7) दया भूतेषु – kindness to creatures, humans or animals or plants too. Such a person will seek apology of भगवान् every morning for unknowingly killing small ants while walking on Earth – this is one prayer which is part of संध्या क्रिया which is done by a few people 3 times a day.

8)  अलोलुप्त्वं – Absence of agitation of senses in the presence of objects. Such a one may see advertisements or attractive packaging or even well advertised books but he remains calm and buys an object only after applying rational thought and knowing his need.

9)  मार्दवं – One who takes on a gentle demeanour.

UB: 10) ह्री: – Modesty. Imagine someone being rich but embarrassed about it. Someone is a great singer but not keen to display this trait. One who is modest naturally knows that his unique traits are not his own but a gift of भगवान्. So they get uncomfortable if someone praises them excessively or gives them awards. And the greatest joy he gets with his voice is to sing the glory of भगवान्.

11) अचापलम् – absence of (meaningless) agitation. When you see people with excessive shaking of legs or roving eyes or inability to stay still in a single place for even a few minutes, you can say that such a person is unstable. But one who is stable has a relaxed demeanor, able to focus on the work at hand and not agitated meaninglessly.

HB: All these traits are extremely desirable but not all have them.

UB: Do not worry – when I start sending the list of traits of असुर, you will see that ALL OF THE people possess these in abundance 😀

HB: I certainly do have them in ample 😂

PK: So true 😃😃

UB : I loved your analogy of expensive hotel for Tyaag characteristic – this is still difficult but seems to me a little easier than saying ” sacrifice your desire to enjoy an expensive hotel temporarily as well ” – the latter is impossible for he with my material matters allure 😃😃

PK: Yup – the bus a separate process of Auspicious daysbusing panchang for weddings etc -Rahu Kalam is for a short time everyday – the muhurtham ( tying the manual  sutra ) will usually not be st Rahu Kalam time even on auspicious / Shubh days I think

UB: तेजः क्षमा धृतिः शौचमद्रोहो नातिमानिता। भवन्ति सम्पदं दैवीमभिजातस्य भारत।।16.3।।

16.3 Brilliance (तेजः), accommodation or patience and understanding (क्षमा), resolve (धृतिः), cleanliness (शौचम्), absence from malice (अद्रोह:), absence of demanding respect from others (न-अतिमानिता) – these are (भवन्ति), O भारत, known as Divine Wealth (दैवीं सम्पदं) for one born with these (अभिजातस्य).

UB: 16:3 (1) – 1) तेजः – One having तेजः exudes brilliance. We come across people who are brilliant in their chosen field of experience. They may be quiet on other matters but when it comes to their domain, they exude knowledge and confidence as well as clarity is visible when they speak. And in their sphere, they will negate others strongly who convey wrong ideas. Equally, one with तेजः will protect himself as well as protect the weaker person too against any onslaught made into such personas.

2) क्षमा stands for accommodation or patience and understanding.

6/7/17, 05:09 UB: 3) धृतिः resolve or ability to be firm in the conduct of what comes under the responsibility of the person. One with धृतिः will not give up easy since he is driven by passion to discharge his responsibility thoroughly. About areas that are not his responsibility, he will keep away and to keep away also requires धृतिः.

4) शौचम् stands for cleanliness, internal and external.

UB: 5)  अद्रोह stands for absence from enmity. Thus while अहिंसा will stand for not doing हिंसा against another person, अद्रोह is a more subtler state where the feeling of enmity itself does not exist and the question of whether हिंसा must be done or not done does not even come up as an issue.

6) न-अतिमानिता stands for absence of demanding respect from others. One having humility (विनय) is not seeking respect from others for boosting his ego. And just as someone having huge wealth will not get upset if someone calls him poor, one having विनय will not be upset if others call him as a man who lacks character. He just smiles and moves on.

UB: Whenever we see any person displaying any or all of these traits at any time, we can say that this one is using his दैवी संपदा. Even if we do not display these traits all the time, when these operate at any time, we must recognize the presence of देव within us at such a time. And the beauty is that even if we deepen our affinity for one trait, we will attract all other दैवी traits.

UB: You are right PK. Some Gurus over-emphasize the “give-up” aspect to such an extreme extent that the message becomes repelling. One needs to precisely define “materialism” to avoid such an extreme. If you take hotel as an example, I see existence of a hotel as  पुरुष or विष्णु and grandeur/ beauty as श्री. If one thus does not enjoy stay in a hotel, one is actually disrespecting श्री-विष्णु and thus losing joy in life. Note that enjoying comes from presence of सत्व within us.

UB: Thus, while one must enjoy everything seeing श्री-विष्णु in all, dwelling in them is “materialism”. Dwelling in objects is a state of wanting called as काम and being obsessed with acquiring them is राग. And काम & राग make us seek श्री-विष्णु  only in their limited expression and thus their grander expression remains distant to us. Thus, if we are convinced of the presence of their grander expression, WHILE ENJOYING THE HOTEL, we remain open for a vision of their grander expression. And “giving up” is not a burden as it is when infested with काम & राग. To conclude, pure enjoyment of everything is not materialism – it just means living a joyful life which is the message from the life of श्रीकृष्ण.

HB: 👌

MK: 👍👍👏👏

PK: 🙏🙏

UB: दम्भो दर्पोऽभिमानश्च क्रोधः पारुष्यमेव च। अज्ञानं चाभिजातस्य पार्थ सम्पदमासुरीम्।।16.4।।

16.4 O पार्थ! Hypocrisy (दम्भ:), arrogance (दर्प:) (not understanding the factors responsible for what one has, thinking “I am responsible for these”), demanding respect from others (अभिमान:), anger (क्रोधः), harshness (पारुष्यम् एव च) and lack of discernment (अज्ञानं च) – are there for one born with (अभिजातस्य) आसुरी संपदा.

दैवी सम्पद्विमोक्षाय निबन्धायासुरी मता। मा शुचः सम्पदं दैवीमभिजातोऽसि पाण्डव।।16.5।।

16.5 दैवी संपदा is considered (मता) to lead to freedom (विमोक्षाय) while आसुरी संपदा to bondage (निबन्धाय). Do not worry (मा शुचः), O पाण्डव, you are (असि) born with (अभिजात:) दैवी संपदा.

UB: 16:4/5 (1) – The opposite of दैवी संपत्ति is आसुरी संपत्ति. आसुरी संपत्ति may sound like “evil” traits but that is a simplistic view. Let us take “anger” – why do I get angry on my daughter if she does not do well in her exams? This is because I expected her to study well and because (I think) she did not put a good effort, she did not perform well. Does it mean that to avoid anger, I should not expect anything? Is it not my duty to think of her well-being?  While thinking of kids’ well being is indeed our धर्म, we must note that anger is an expression of loss of control over oneself. So if I shout on my girl as a well-thought कर्म merely to push her out of her comfort zone but deep inside, I am calm and peaceful, my act of shouting is not a loss of control and thus not “anger”.

UB: 16:4/5 (2) An आसुरी कर्म is not bad in an absolute sense. In fact, there is no pure “Devil” or “Satan” in the वेद. It is just that certain traits manifest within us which keep us limited and certain others make us expand. Choose wisely is thus the message with a line that choosing आसुरी traits will compel us to undertake sub-optimal कर्म which will make us and others around us suffer. And आसुरी traits manifest within us since we carry innate likings and cravings and we get unsettled and lose control when life does not align with these cravings. अध्यात्म makes us question these cravings and inform us that events in our life and life of others happen on account of their own dynamic.

UB: 16:4/5 (3) – So our engagement in a certain event with others must be such that in the long run, both sides expand. Thus, if a तमस् kid does not do well, we may use anger to startle the kid. If a रजस् kid does not do well, we may use fear of competition to stir the kid and if a सत्व kid does not do well, we may use positive reinforcement. Note that I have said – “use anger” or “use fear” and this does not mean I am angry or fearful.

UB: 16:4/5 (4) – श्रीकृष्ण states that दैवी संपदा is useful for freedom while the other continues to keep us in a state of कर्म बन्धन. One who is दैवी does not become ज्ञानी automatically; he merely acquires capability to study अध्यात्म. And श्रीकृष्ण did well at the right time to answer the question that may have gone through the mind of अर्जन as to whether he has दैवी संपदा. A master conversationalist is one who already knows what may be going on in the mind of the other and gives answers before questions are raised.

UB: द्वौ भूतसर्गौ लोकेऽस्मिन् दैव आसुर एव च। दैवो विस्तरशः प्रोक्त आसुरं पार्थ मे श्रृणु।।16.6।।

16.6 In this world (लोकेऽस्मिन्) there are two manifestation of (human) beings (द्वौ भूतसर्गौ): the दैव and the आसुर (दैव आसुर एव च). The दैव has been spoken of (प्रोक्त) elaborately (विस्तरशः). Listen to Me (मे श्रृणु) about the आसुर (आसुरं), O पार्थ.

प्रवृत्तिं च निवृत्तिं च जना न विदुरासुराः। न शौचं नापि चाचारो न सत्यं तेषु विद्यते।।16.7।।

16.7 People (जना) who are आसुरी do not know (न विदु:) what activity to pursue (प्रवृत्तिं) and what activity to not pursue (निवृत्तिं). In them (तेषु), there is (विद्यते) no inner cleanliness (न शौचं) or even valid conduct (न अपि आचार:) or truthfulness (न च सत्यं).

UB: 16:6/7 (1) – To rebel is seen as fashionable in today’s time. The wisdom is – “Only fools are obedient”. And “Rules” are the villain. “Challenge the rules” or “Challenge religion” or “Challenge boundaries” is seen as wisdom. But there is a difference between how a दैवी one will challenge unlike an असुर. A दैवी is positive in the sense that he will attempt to interpret the spirit behind the rule and will either follow it or define a modern equivalent that may be more useful in today’s context. If he is not convinced at all, he will not follow it but blame himself for not being able to align with the mind of the ऋषि who framed the rule. An असुर will merely say that all rules are meant to be broken, he will challenge a rule using reverse psychology and will merely state that all rules were meant for suppressing the downtrodden. But no new rule will be formulated or provided to pursue the end goal; thus driving people including himself in तमस् by doing no कर्म.

UB: 16:6/7 (2) – We often see people unable to decide or decide impulsively. Such decisions could include which clothes to buy or what food to eat in a restaurant or bigger decisions. Equally, there are people who are unable to figure out when or where to stop talking or stop eating food or stop watching TV. Confusion in being unable to decide is thus an आसुरी quality. अध्यात्म seeks bright alert minds and dull/ slow thinking minds infested in तमस् are not suited for सिद्धि in this sphere. Rules of conduct on how to engage with various types of people, elders, kids, spouse, etc have been elaborated in धर्म texts. Many of such prescriptions are seen as unnecessary today or even enforced foolishly without understanding the spirit.

UB: 16:6/7 (3) – What is meant by being truthful? It is a wider concept than just speaking truth. Essentially, in every situation, we have a certain role to play or a responsibility to discharge. Our thought has to align with this role. And what we speak to ourselves and people around us must be aligned with this thought.  And finally the action we take must align with our thought and speech. If the thought, speech and action are not just misaligned with each other but also misaligned with our role in a certain situation, we are being untruthful. An असुर does not align with सत्यम् and thus takes on huge stress in life for himself and also creates stress for others around him.

UB: Tomorrow is a long write-up on the world view of an extreme materialist.

UB: असत्यमप्रतिष्ठं ते जगदाहुरनीश्वरम्। अपरस्परसम्भूतं किमन्यत्कामहैतुकम्।।16.8।।

16.8 They maintain (ते आहु:): ‘The world  (जगत्) is without truth (असत्यम्) (because they themselves are untruthful), without any (ethical) basis (अप्रतिष्ठं) and is Godless (अनीश्वरम्) (because they are) and are born (सम्भूतं) of mutual union (अपरस्पर) (of male and female) due to lust (काम-हैतुकम्) – What else? Nothing else (किम् अन्यद्).

UB: 16:8 (1) – These verses give the perfect definition of a materialist. There used to be a branch of people known as Lokayatas who only believe what they see. When asked how life happens, they are clear that consciousness comes from matter. I am not sure if they based this opinion based on any study but as per them, when all of matter is in a condensed form, life comes out of this state. Thus for them, all of life has emerged from inert matter and all events in the world are as per मत्स्य न्याय (survival of the fittest)  and all creatures including humans are only born because of lust between male and female.

UB: 16:8 (2) – Even if we keep aside whether the view is right or not, what could be the extreme outcome if this view is taken as true? If everything in the world is seen as random and arbitrary, why even bother about anything? If parents gave birth to me only out of lust, why respect lusty people? If lust and मत्स्य न्याय is the only basis of life, why should anything be seen as sacred? Trees give fruits because they have no choice – value the tree till it gives fruits and then cut it. Value the cow till it gives milk and then kill it. Value parents till they give you money and then dump them into an old age home when they become irritable in old age. Value a spouse till the spouse adds value to me or else I must divorce – why must two people stick to each other unless they add value to each other? Ethics are required only till it meets my desires, rule of law is needed so that everyone in society can pursue their individual needs. What else is there to life besides needs fulfilment? So value only such things that give us joy or else dump them.

UB: 16:8 (3) – Is the above an extreme view?  Most literate people value Science and as per Science, Consciousness came from Matter (though not stated with certainty but as a WIP hypothesis). So a counterview can be stated that despite having this world view, the world still exists, there is a general level of peace in the world and people still value each other, is it not? I am not sure. If you look at environment movement today, protection of environment is not being pursued since प्रकृति is seen as पवित्रं but because its destruction is harmful to mankind – this is an आसुरी view.

UB: 16:8 (4) – “What’s in it for me?” is the driving motto. If thus people still seem moral and have not become a free for all, it is because they are getting value for themselves by being “seemingly” moral. The day the perceived value goes down and alternatives modes come about, why should anyone retain trees and not burn up oceans? After all, are they not inert and dumb? Even Philanthropy is done because it adds value to another and if others are happy, I get value in terms of self-actualization. Or दानं is done because God will give me पुण्य and this again is a need fulfilment कर्म though seemingly noble. Equally, it is not the science postulate that guides our lifeview but it is the दैवी गुण we have practiced in our current and paste lives that has become our habit and this innate habitual orientation is keeping rampant materialism in a subdued state.

UB: 16:8 (5) – What is the आधार of our mind?  Our body. What is the आधार of our body? Earth. What is the आधार of Earth? The Sun. What is the आधार of the Sun? Space. What is the आधार of Space? 🤔 This is where conversation is possibly struck today though we may have multiple theories/ opinions once one reaches this level. An atheist will not like an answer that the आधार of Space is God because the following question will be – What is the आधार of God? वेद will say – He rests in Himself which will not be liked as an answer. Equally, if someone answers that the आधार of Space is concentrated matter, one invites an obvious follow-up question – What is the आधार of concentrated matter? Of course we can conclude that God=Concentrated Matter but neither side will like this answer 😊.

UB: 16:8 (6) – Both a true Scientist or a true अध्यात्म person will not dismiss the other view but pursue both streams of thought to investigate further. Both know that the source of Universe is One, whether you call it matter or God. And both will continue their investigations into this idea of One in their own unique ways. And both will respect the others’ opinion since they do not have the final उत्तर themselves. Such ones are of सत्व mindset and thus दैवी. Ones who dismiss the others and pull others’ दृष्टिकोण down even though they do not have the final उत्तर have रजस् driving their persona. People with तमस् are not even bothered. They may say – “Will an answer to this question impact my evening dinner? If not, why waste time in inane questions?” 😊.

PK: UB : while I see the gist of what you are conveying , how I would love to discuss,  face to face,  some points you raise ( and assert 😃😃) over a glass of fine wine …sigh … these are the limitations of WA but I would rather live in a world with it than without 😃

UB: 😀😀 This chapter has just begun. There is a lot more Krishna will say. Not sure if anything will be left to discuss post this 😀

UB: एतां दृष्टिमवष्टभ्य नष्टात्मानोऽल्पबुद्धयः। प्रभवन्त्युग्रकर्माणः क्षयाय जगतोऽहिताः।।16.9।।

16.9 Having recourse (अवष्टभ्य) to this view (एतां दृष्टिम्), (where there is no personal responsibility towards others or for oneself) whose intellects are lost (नष्ट- आत्मान:), of poor intellect (अल्प-बुद्धयः), whose minds are limited (to sense pursuits), who are of cruel actions (उग्रकर्माणः) – these enemies (अहिता:) are set (प्रभवन्ति) for destroying (क्षयाय) the world (जगत:).

काममाश्रित्य दुष्पूरं दम्भमानमदान्विताः। मोहाद्गृहीत्वासद्ग्राहान्प्रवर्तन्तेऽशुचिव्रताः।।16.10।।

16.10 Taking to (आश्रित्य) desires (कामम्) that is insatiable (दुष्पूरं), filled with (अन्विता:) hypocrisy (दम्भ), demands for respect (मान) and with arrogance (मद), assuming (गृहीत्वा) improper understanding (असद्ग्राहान्) due to delusion (मोहाद्); and with unworthy vows (अशुचि-व्रताः), they keep going (प्रवर्तन्ते).

UB: 16:9/10 (1) – A materialist may say – “I will live only for a few years”. An अध्यात्म person may also know that life is limited. But the consequent actions will be different. The materialist may say – “Since I will die anyway, I might as well indulge myself and then die” while the other may say – “Since life is short, let me do धर्म every moment of my life”.  भगवान् uses two strong words for a materialist. He is a नष्टात्मान: meaning he keeps killing himself with his actions. He is also a अल्पबुद्धि meaning one having limited intellect. Why is it so?

UB: 16:9/10 (2) – भगवान् uses the word नष्टात्मान: since a person focussed only in काम will never dwell into investigation into the आधार of his existence. In 13th Chapter, भगवान् defined the word आत्महत्या as one who kills his आत्मा by focussing on the limited and a कामी is therefore defined as नष्टात्मान: for the same reason here. अल्पबुद्धि is also an adjective used for a similar reason. Since he is focussing his whole life on the limited (meaning अल्प), the idea of unlimited आत्मा will be seen as alien to him. A ज्ञानी will also enjoy a good movie while a कामी will also enjoy. The only difference between them is that the ज्ञानी knows that the joy out of the movie is limited while a कामी thinks that there is joy ONLY in watching a movie. Thus, while a ज्ञानी will not bind himself to watch a movie or go to a restaurant every weekend, a कामी binds himself to this lifestyle. Thus, a कामी remains अल्प or limited since काम becomes the driver of his weekly life and thus called as a अल्पबुद्धि.

UB: 16:9/10 (3) – What is the purpose of life when I was a small kid?  To play. What is the purpose when I was a teenager?  To pass exams. What is the purpose when I was a working person? To achieve success in career by being ahead of others (viz a रजस् need) and get married. When I was a married person – to get kids. When I was a parent of teenage kids – to give them best education. When I am a parent of kids who have a good occupation – to get them married and become a grandparent. When I am still alive and have teenage grandkids – to get them married 😊. While some nuances will exist in these narratives, bottom line is that the whole life is driven by some vow or another triggered by insatiable काम. The whole life is spent on chasing seemingly important काम goals but no time is available for the unlimited.

UB: 16:9/10 (4) – A तमस् may take to becoming a journalist since it looks glamorous. A रजस् is inspired by popular journalists and he seeks to follow them to gain popularity or status of the one who inspires him. Both are असुर. A सत्व gets excited by the investigative aspect of a journalist role and gets inspired by the insightful work or writings of popular journalists and seeks to take to the profession to get exposure to doing such work himself. Thus, while all of them may end up in the same office, each will view success differently and will approach the same work with different mindsets. भगवान् therefore says that an असुर is one who has improper understanding of events/ people (असद्ग्राहान) owing to his own innate prejudices. If learning from events in life is tinted or dented, the consequent कर्म taken on is also limited thus turning the entire opportunity given by a human life into living an animal existence.

HB: So true 😧

MK: Question is where do we draw the line? I think after our kids are in college, we should start to withdraw from their lives. I feel that it’s our duty to pay for their education as per our capability but some people in the west think otherwise as well. Trick is in letting go but still helping out when needed without attachment. (so difficult 😉

HB: I agree but its difficult to withdraw. But try we must 😊

UB: Issue of ‘letting go’ comes only if one has held on to something in the first place. The idea of Gita is to live the entire life from बाल अवस्था doing निष्काम कर्म meaning that we live our entire discharging all धर्म actively and with enthusiasm but with our eye always focussed on the eternal in all stages.

MK: 👍👍👏👏Yes, निष्काम कर्म would be fantastic if we can really do it ….but I think the most difficult part of attachment is our kids and the earlier we get out of this मोह, the better it will be for us 😀

UB: 😀👍🏼

UB: चिन्तामपरिमेयां च प्रलयान्तामुपाश्रिताः। कामोपभोगपरमा एतावदिति निश्चिताः।।16.11।।

16.11 Committed to (उपाश्रिताः) innumerable (अपरिमेयां) worries (चिन्ताम्) (over their possessions) which last till death (प्रलय-अन्ताम्), having consumption of desirable objects (काम उपभोग) as the ultimate (परमा:), having concluded (निश्चिताः) that life is “only this much” (एतावद् इति).

आशापाशशतैर्बद्धाः कामक्रोधपरायणाः। ईहन्ते कामभोगार्थमन्यायेनार्थसञ्चयान्।।16.12।।

16.12 Bound by (बद्धाः) hundreds of shackles (पाश-शतै:) in the form of hope (आशा), having as their goal (परायणाः)(more and more exaggerated) needs and anger (कामक्रोध), they engage in (ईहन्ते) amassing means of enjoyment (अर्थ-सञ्चयान्) through unethical means (अन्यायेन) for the enjoyment of desirable objects (काम-भोग-अर्थम्).

UB: Imagine भगवान् coming to us and assuring us with certainty that we will live long enough to see that our current list of desires are fulfilled – our kids settle well, our career will give us reasonable fame, our friends will stay with us in a jovial manner throughout life, our parents will be happy, etc. How will we receive this information? For some time, we may feel happy but this assurance also creates a vacuum. Is this all there is to life? Should I have conveyed more as my list of desires to भगवान्? 😊

UB: Uncertainty creates a spirit of adventure to life and makes pursuit of the unknown enjoyable despite its attendant tensions. When the unknown becomes known, while there may be a temporary satisfaction, a vaccum sets in. And we feel that we may have been better off if भगवान् kept future unknown to us. Thus, if our future is predicted fully in a thorough manner, will life remain fun? One will no doubt wonder – what i am gaining by living this predictable life? What is the purpose of living this predictable life?

UB: The difference between असुर and देव is this – an असुर lives life thinking that life is only about desiring and doing work to achieve desires. And he keeps on adding desires to improve the quality of his life’s achievements. And he loves the adventure into the unknown and works hard to live his world view. A देव knows that life will give him outcomes as per his प्रारब्ध – so he also works very hard in every role that he is put into not focussing on outcomes (which are irrelevant really) but to know himself better and better. He is really figuring himself out step by step in every action. He is pursuing the idea of becoming complete and “uses” desires to get to the path of completion and thus desires or responsibilities of life are a means for his end goal while for an असुर, desires are an end goal.

PA: Figuring himself out step by step 👍👍👏🏻

PA: Even if the current list of desires are completely fulfilled we might be happy for sometime and very soon there will be a new list of desires that are ready to be fulfilled 😊

UB: 😀😀

MK: So true…no end to desires …I can spend any amount of money …maybe true for all women …haha

UB: इदमद्य मया लब्धमिमं प्राप्स्ये मनोरथम्। इदमस्तीदमपि मे भविष्यति पुनर्धनम्।।16.13।।

16.13 ‘This (इदं) I (मया) have gained (लब्धम्) today (अद्य), and this desire (मनोरथम्) I shall attain (प्राप्स्ये). This wealth (धनम्) I have now (इदं अस्ति), and (पुन:) this also (इदं अपि) shall be mine (मे) hereafter (भविष्यति).

असौ मया हतः शत्रुर्हनिष्ये चापरानपि। ईश्वरोऽहमहं भोगी सिद्धोऽहं बलवान्सुखी।।16.14।।

16.14 ‘I (मया) have destroyed (हतः) this enemy (असौ शत्रु:), and others (अपरान् च) I will also destroy (अपि हनिष्ये). I am the ruler (अहं ईश्वर:), I am the enjoyer (अहं भोगी), I am successful (अहं सिद्ध:), powerful (बलवान्) and happy (सुखी).’

आढ्योऽभिजनवानस्मि कोऽन्योऽस्ति सदृशो मया। यक्ष्ये दास्यामि मोदिष्य इत्यज्ञानविमोहिताः।।16.15।।

16.15 ‘I am rich (अहं आढ्य:) and have an exalted family (अभिजनवान् अस्मि); who else (क: अन्य:) is there (अस्ति) equal (सदृश:) to me (मया)? I shall perform rituals (यक्ष्ये); I shall give (दास्यामि), I shall enjoy (मोदिष्ये),’-thus (इति) those (boast) who are variously lacking in discernment (विमोहिताः) due to ignorance (अज्ञान) (of धर्म and अधर्म, much less of आत्मा).

UB: 16:13/15 (1) – Whole life is spent on acquiring something or the other. When one need ends, another begins. And all achievements are linked to ego thereby giving a lot of pride in one’s achievements. Pride in one’s wealth or family is intense for such people who also always justify how their achievements are superior to others. All his acquisitions give him joy making his joys dependent on the acquisitions. His “higher” identity is valued through the prism of petty acquisitions only.

UB: 16:13/15 (2) – He calls himself as ईश्वर but this ईश्वर is not पुरुष or भगवान् but he relates his ego to ईश्वर. He may do rituals but feels joy that HE is doing rituals. He may even donate and feels joy that HE is donating. Life is merely meant to be a play of acquiring and spending or working hard and playing hard for an असुर. Excessive comparison with others comes from presence of रजस् and for such ones, life is seen as a race and life’s goal is seen as running ahead of all beating others in this race. He will thus not like to be told there are other factors that are behind what he is seeing and experiencing. Not only does he find spiritual discussions distasteful, he will also be upset with people who are wasting time in pursuing abstract ideas and theories 😊.

PA: Ego is always looking for the next . What’s next ..The desire that is fulfilled looses its value and is replaced by 2 more. On another view I read somewhere that if you are not expanding or growing you are falling back as everything is on motion and expansion. So doing nothing or just staying still would mean stagnation and falling back. If you suppress your natural desires by curbing it it finds sometime another outlet without our knowledge. Perhaps this desire to acquire spiritual knowledge may also be a form of unseen ego taking a different form. As long as we have this human body the desire for expansion and growth will be there i feel. So what’s the solution? Somewhere i read. If life offers a lemon then make a lemonade and don’t look to make something else. Just taking each and every situation that life offers as a real gift and making the best of the situation without comparison with what could have been and what should have been.

VN: Totally agree with you PA….. In short take it as it comes… Go with the flow. But definitely these teachings help us to do this naturally without great efforts.

UB: अनेकचित्तविभ्रान्ता मोहजालसमावृताः। प्रसक्ताः कामभोगेषु पतन्ति नरकेऽशुचौ।।16.16।।

16.16 Variously deluded (विभ्रान्ता) by many such thoughts (अनेकचित्त), enveloped by (समावृताः) a net of delusion (मोहजाल), (and) attached to (प्रसक्ताः) the objects of desire (कामभोगेषु), they fall into (पतन्ति) an unworthy hell (नरके-अशुचौ).

UB: 16:16 (1) – As per वेद, there are four पुरुषार्थ (goals) of life – धर्म, अर्थ, काम and मोक्ष. अर्थ stands for accumulation of means of enjoyment while काम for gaining pleasure from such means. Note that अर्थ & काम are the पुरुषार्थ of animals too since they also spend their life in accumulating and eating. But for humans, अर्थ & काम is meant to be bound by धर्म on one side and मोक्ष on another. Thus, only such अर्थ must be earned that is obtained in a धार्मिक manner and काम indulgence must not be so much that the real purpose of life viz मोक्ष is slighted or ignored. Thus, if the river of अर्थ & काम overflows, the banks of धर्म & मोक्ष will also get drowned and such a river becomes a river of संसार viz beset with दु:ख (abode of limitedness).

UB: 16:16 (2) – When a person lives enveloped by thoughts expressed in the previous verse, it is clear that only अर्थ & काम dominate his world-view. And when अर्थ & काम dominate a world view, one is living in the zone of प्रकृति only where life is no different from that of an animal. Hence, because of their own behaviour and liking, they are born in नरक meaning they are born either as animals or born in ecosystems where अर्थ & काम are the mainstay. Scope for अध्यात्म growth is ruled out primarily owing to choices exercised by such people on their own.

UB: 16:16 (3) – Is भगवान् cursing people who base their life in अर्थ & काम? Are रजस् and तमस bad qualities? We need to be careful in getting into such reductionism. A कामी infested with रजस् is not bad in an absolute sense. To use an analogy, both one with देव & असुर will need the रजस् trait to climb a hill but while असुर is using रजस् to climb a hill next door, देव is climbing Mt Everest post which there is no record to beat. In fact, one with a high level of रजस्  may be competitive in a positive sense, live a moral life owing to presence of some दैवी गुण within himself and may never even trouble an insect.

UB: 16:16 (4) – But what is the use of owing a racing car and using it only to fetch veggies from a nearby mall driving it at 20 KMPH? It is akin to a beggar who, when given wealth, dreams of begging in a Rolls Royce rather than using it to uplift his lifestyle. Similarly, because रजस् and तमस् dominate the persona of an अर्थकामी, such a one ends up using his दैवी गुण only for अर्थ-काम viz akin to living in the zone of नरक. And one need not be born as a human if one wants to live in this zone only. So while अर्थ-काम is a legitimate goal of life, वेद says that making these as the ONLY goal is what makes an असुर lifestyle stunted. असुर lifestyle is thus to be seen not as bad but wasted where one is caught in a cycle of repetition of trying to gain happiness by doing the same thing again and again.

6/14/17, 04:42 UB: 👍🏼 PA – I think both “accepting” and “aspiring” must go together. Just “accepting” could make one lazy not to seek anything bigger. And better is expression of expansion on the material front than just “accepting” status quo. And thus, “aspiring” & “trying” for expansion is also key while “accepting” the outcome may be a good motto to live on.

PA: Very nice words. Accepting and aspiring👍👍👏🏻 And again a hint to he golden key of balance between the 2 forces of nature and the opposites: The first step be thankful and the next step to activate ones energy for the next level. It’s like one has to eat and not eat(eat but stop when not hungry); work and not work; happy and not happy (what today is cause of happiness  is the cause of unhappiness in the future); sad and not sad (today’s sadness will turn also to happiness later). Sleep and not sleep (sleep to regenerate oversleep lead to lethargy). Extremes in each side lead to Misery I feel.

PK: Well put PA 👍👍

UB: 👍🏼👍🏼👏🏼

PA: 🙏🏻🙏🏻struggling though to find the golden middle path. 😊

VN: 👌👌🙌🙌

PK: As we all are .., I tell myself that the journey is as important if not more than the destination .. Esp when my tamas tendencies dominate 😃😃😃

UB: आत्मसम्भाविताः स्तब्धा धनमानमदान्विताः। यजन्ते नामयज्ञैस्ते दम्भेनाविधिपूर्वकम्।।16.17।।

16.17 Honoured only by themselves (आत्म-सम्भाविताः), pompous (स्तब्धा), filled with (अन्विताः) demands for respect (मान) and intoxicated (मद) because of wealth (धन), they (ते) perform यज्ञ (यजन्ते) which are so in name only (नाम यज्ञै:), with hypocrisy (दम्भेन) and not in accordance with the injunctions (अविधिपूर्वकम्).

अहङ्कारं बलं दर्पं कामं क्रोधं च संश्रिताः। मामात्मपरदेहेषु प्रद्विषन्तोऽभ्यसूयकाः।।16.18।।

16.18 Those who are given to (संश्रिताः) (exaggerated) self-opinion (अहङ्कारं), power (बलं), arrogance (दर्पं), desirable objects (कामं) and anger (क्रोधं च), despising (प्रद्विषन्त:) Me (मां) in their own and others’ bodies (आत्म-परदेहेषु), and cynical (अभ्यसूयकाः)

UB: 16:17/18 (1) – An असुर will also do यज्ञ but the intent is to show off. So if the surrounding society has value for यज्ञ, these guys will also perform यज्ञ to show off. They will do पूजा not with भक्ति but to show off to the world that they are धार्मिक. They may donate money to temples but they would like their name to be inscribed on the temple walls. They will perform marriages but the focus is not on the पंडित or marriage vows but more on video shooting, music and dance, etc. Since music and dance is more important, they will compromise on the injunctions or rules of marriage or even पूजा since the primary intent is not पूजा in the first place. If questioned as to why did they not follow the rules, they will reply that all rules are human created and there is no rule that cannot be broken. This confidence of blabber comes from presence of money or power or objects in their possession and humility is thus thrown away by the wayside.

UB: 16:17/18 (2) – When such people become supremely over-confident, भगवान् says that they hate Him both in their bodies as well as that of others. When one is in a frame of mind not to listen to others at all, one will end up doing what one likes. Thus they eat what they like, they sing what they like, they look down upon others who have lesser possessions than themselves and talk to all with arrogance. This means that प्रकृति viz their lower mind dominates to such an extent that पुरुष is looked down upon. They are cynical of शास्त्र, they are cynical of Gurus, they are cynical of elderly people who have more experience since their own minds are intoxicated with ideas of their own (seeming) invincibility.

UB: 16:17/18 (3) – There is a difference between an असुर who does not listen to others and one with दैवी गुण who too may not listen to others. A lazy man does not get up even when pleaded to as his act is backed by तमस्. An ambitious man will not stop working very hard for maximizing profits of his business since this drive is backed by काम & राग and will not listen to any logic other than enhancing profits. And a दैवी one will not listen to anyone (including his so-called well wishers) who will want to keep him stunted and stop him from pursuing his goal of all-inclusive freedom. The act of “not listening” may be common but there is a world of difference between what triggers their act of remaining headstrong. We must therefore be careful in reaching sub-optimal conclusions by watching people externally.

VN: 👌👌👍🏻

PA: 👍😃yeah

UB: तानहं द्विषतः क्रूरान्संसारेषु नराधमान्। क्षिपाम्यजस्रमशुभानासुरीष्वेव योनिषु।।16.19।।

16.19 Those (तान्) hateful (द्विषतः), cruel (क्रूरान्), the lowest among people (नर-अधमान्) who do deeds which lack merit (अशुभान्), I (अहं) continually (अजस्रं) toss (क्षिपामि) into paths of existence (संसारेषु), into the wombs of असुर (आसुरीषु  एव योनिषु).

असुरीं योनिमापन्ना मूढा जन्मनि जन्मनि। मामप्राप्यैव कौन्तेय ततो यान्त्यधमां गतिम्।।16.20।।

16.20 O कौन्तेय! Those lacking discernment (मूढा), falling into (आपन्ना) an आसुरी womb (असुरीं योनिम्) birth after birth (जन्मनि जन्मनि), of course, having not attained Me (माम् अप्राप्य एव) – they go (यान्ति) from there (तत:) (all the way) to the lowest end (अधमां गतिम्).

UB: 16:19/ 20 (1) – भगवान् is using strong भाषा here and one wonders whether श्रीकृष्ण is bearing an expression of disgust when expressing these words. One with दैवी गुण may experience a tinge of fear while an आसुरी may treat these words as nonsense. And why is an आसुरी thrown into wombs of असुर again and again? भगवान् does this not because he dislikes them personally but because such people prefer such ecosystems only. There are no accidents and भगवान् grants such a lifestyle to us that we choose for ourselves by living an आसुरी lifestyle and thus opening ourselves up for कर्मफल of such an ecosystem.

UB: 16:19/20 (2) – भगवान् uses two adjectives here for an आसुरी – क्रूरान् viz cruel and अधम viz one having lowest बुद्धि. Is this not unfair? After all, is भगवान् not operating in all – can He hate Himself? Is all of life not resting on the One? Why is भगवान् making these distinctions between people and castigating असुर by calling them “hateful”? Could he not be slightly mellow or muted instead of using such strong words? Maybe भगवान् is not guided by notions of “political-correctedness” 😊. If we have a self-image of honesty and we do a dishonest act, will we not hate ourselves? Will we not hate ourselves for using अभद्र भाषा with our parents? भगवान् also thus carries a similar kind of hatred when a part of Himself revels in प्रकृति and forgets His own सत्-चित्-आनन्द state.

UB: 16:19/20 (3) – We must remember the अश्वत्थ tree at the start of  15th Ch – there are beings who are close to the मूल and thus have सूक्ष्मता while those far away from the मूल are स्थूल. Those who are स्थूल are like the outer branches of a tree and are therefore more exposed to elements of nature and thus suffer more while those closer to the root and main stem are more stable inside. People obsessed with अर्थ-काम are स्थूल and will thus suffer more than those who are सत्व driven and it is this fact that is stated as a matter-of-fact truth rather than with any contempt and disgust. But if we are स्थूल ourselves, we may detect contempt and disgust but one with दैवी गुण will see this as a well reasoned truth.

UB: Two more days and we will conclude Ch 16. Ch 17 continues this theme which highlights how one with an innate गुण orientation prefers – what he eats, how he donates, how do they do worship, etc. We can compare our own innate preferences with what is highlighted in Ch 17 and position ourselves. Unless of course, we have already put ourselves in the तमस् bucket 😀

PK: One issue I seem to be having with these descriptions is that they are all in the extremes … most folks are in the middle muddling along and I think not having any fear while reading these words is fine ….any belief motivated by fear is imperfect …definitely moi is tamas 😃😃😃

PK: There is a subtle but important difference between cynicism and skepticism – I am definitely in the latter group and need guidance beyond fear of rebirth 😃😃😃

VB: All I interpreted from this chapter is what shud be the right path and make attempts to go there. I don’t care about the labels. Would we be happier if we had a 10 levels and we find ourselves to be in level 5. This is a 3 level thing, that is all. PK, with you. Though on level 5

PA: Things We Cannot Control – BY MADISYN TAYLOR

We develop grace as we learn with the guiding hand of the universe, life will unfold exactly the way it should. The idea of trusting the universe is a popular one these days, but many of us don’t know what this really means and we often have a hard time doing it. This is partly because the story of humankind is most often presented as a story about struggle, control, and survival, instead of one of trust and collaboration with the universe. Yet, in truth, we need to adhere to both ideas in this life.  On the one hand, there is much to be said about exerting control over our environment. We created shelter to protect ourselves from the elements. We hunted for animals and invented agriculture to feed ourselves. We built social infrastructures to protect ourselves and create community. This is how we survive and grow as a civilization. However, it is also clear that there are plenty of things that we cannot control, no matter how hard we try, and we often receive support from an unseen force – a universe that provides us with what we cannot provide for ourselves.  It is a good idea to take responsibility for the things in life that we can control or create. We work so we can feed, clothe, and shelter our loved ones and ourselves. We manifest our dreams and visions in physical form with hard work and forethought. But at a certain point, when have done all that we can, we must let go and allow the universe to take over. This requires trust. It requires a trust that runs deeper than just expecting things to turn out the way we want them to. Sometimes they will, and sometimes they won’t. We develop equanimity and grace as we learn to trust that, with the guiding hand of the universe, life will unfold exactly the way it should. We are engaged in an ongoing relationship with a universe that responds to our thoughts and actions.

PA: Something which resonates well with the idea of understanding when to let go

UB: PK – You are right about use of extremes especially because रजस् & तमस् have been combined under असुर while extremes are directed towards the राक्षस types in whom तमस् is dominant. Humans are primarily of the  रजस् type as a general rule which is the middle category. As for fear, we in रजस् will not have fear of rebirth but will have fears about career issues, financial security, kids’ future, etc. So fear exists but for some other aspects 😀.

PK: Very well said 👍… reminded me ” give me the strength to change ( control 😃) what I can , the equanimity to accept what I cannot control ( change) and most importantly the wisdom to know the difference 😃😃

UB: Sensible words PA 👍🏼

PA: This is from one of my favorite web sites daily OM by Madisyn Taylor I just copy pasted

PK: Agree with you – this dual comparison makes sone conclusions extreme.., see your punt about fear of career , kids etc but to me that is different from fear in the spiritual domain .., the latter to me is an intensely personal journey – one in which it is critical to distinguish between what one does to keep peace/ out of life for family and what one truly believes in their innermost heart .., it is important to be mentally faithful to oneself .., gauging folks by outward actions as you have mentioned, carries  a real risk of arriving at suboptimal conclusions

PK: Out of love for family .., not life 😂

PA: Yes UB spot on the fears for career, future financial security kids’ education and career and then their future and so on are the ones that  one clings on to.  Some where in the older commentaries of the last chapter this  fear is kind of positiv fear ad it propels us forward. One can look back and be happy and thankful of all the milestones that have been covered and be inspired for continuing the journey further. The biggest gift would be not to let our mind interfere with the task at hand and pose  it’s negative self sabotaging and non-productive programming and not worry about the outcome of a situation.

PK: Agree 👍…one advantage of Amreeka is that our lack of control in our children’s life choices is drummed in early 😃😃😃.., so the desire to micromanage their lives is less to begin with and lessens over time.., most times I am telling my kids that I am like a counselor .., I can advice and with their dad provide some $$ for education but what they do with their life is up to them😃😃😃.., We would really prefer that become productive adults and move out vs living in our basements ( this opinion I find in my desi group of friends is always received  with a bemused look) 😃😃

PK: I have less than zero desire to live with my son ( and his spouse) full time in retirement 😃😃😃… that lack of choice and dependence would be my version of hell

PA: 👍😊scaling back ones expectations from ones children is definitely nice as from this low level of expectation everything will be a bonus

PK: Satyavachan 👍👍… Affection out of choice vs obligation

UB: त्रिविधं नरकस्येदं द्वारं नाशनमात्मनः। कामः क्रोधस्तथा लोभस्तस्मादेतत्त्रयं त्यजेत्।।16.21।।

16.21 Desire (ie wanting) (कामः), anger (क्रोध:) and greed (तथा लोभ)- This is the threefold (इदं त्रिविधं) gate of नरक (नरकस्य द्वारं) (i.e., painful experience) which is the loss of oneself (नाशनम् आत्मनः). Therefore (तस्मात् one should give up (त्यजेत्) these three (एतद् त्रयं).

एतैर्विमुक्तः कौन्तेय तमोद्वारैस्त्रिभिर्नरः। आचरत्यात्मनः श्रेयस्ततो याति परां गतिम्।।16.22।।

16.22 O कौन्तेय! Being freed (विमुक्त:) from these three (एतै: त्रिभि:) doors to darkness (तमस् द्वारै:), one (नर:) follows (आचरति) what is good (श्रेय:) for oneself (आत्मन:). Thereupon (तत:), that one gains (याति) a Higher end (परां गतिम्).

UB: 16:21/22 (1) – There is a संस्कृत line which reads as – “साक्षरा विपरीताश्र्चेत् राक्षसा एव केवलम्”. This means if a साक्षरा which is स+अक्षरा meaning a literate person does not behave morally and takes on to काम, क्रोध, etc., he becomes the opposite viz a राक्षसा. This person becomes a literate idiot, so to speak. So one who has अक्षर ज्ञान and has information on how the world operates and thus is able to use this information for survival may be called as a “literate”. But one who may or may not have अक्षर ज्ञान but has दैवी संपदा may be termed as an “educated” person. While the world today giving importance to increase literacy, is similar effort being made to increase education?

UB: 16:21/22 (2) – The long narrative on असुर state is now being summed up in three words – काम, क्रोध & लोभ. काम is a state of “wanting”. One who is established in an अभाव स्थिति wants to fill up such vacuum by obtaining what he feels he lacks. Such a person lives with an expectation that life is really lived by one who keeps working towards filling up the अभाव with people and objects. Filling up अभाव स्थिति by acquiring objects is like pouring घी into अग्नि – the person continues to remain in अभाव स्थिति. And क्रोध (or its shades like frustration, depression, etc) are a natural outcome for one whose काम is unsatiated. लोभ or greed is grosser काम and comes for wanting to possess a specific object or a certain relationship. This gross need expression of possessiveness over what one has or intends to have is लोभ and aspects like miserliness, excessive going for lockers, security systems at home, taking multiple insurance policies, etc arise from लोभ.

UB: 16:21/22 (3) – भगवान् emphatically states that one established in these three states is surely tied to नरक. So the door to freedom is to stay away from these three. And once one does आचरण that is श्रेय: will surely go towards पुरुष. Why so? It is very difficult in our day to day life to stay away from these three. Even if we are unattached, society will push us towards these three. Thus conquering these three will involve a lot of struggle and thinking. One literally has to be on a war mode to remain calm, not have greed, etc. And if after this bitter war between देव & असुर within us, if our दैवी संपत्ति is able to prevail, who can stop us from achieving the Highest? No one.

UB: यः शास्त्रविधिमुत्सृज्य वर्तते कामकारतः। न स सिद्धिमवाप्नोति न सुखं न परां गतिम्।।16.23।।

16.23 The one who (य:), casting away (उत्सृज्य) the scriptural injunctions (शास्त्र विधिम्) acts (वर्तते) out the impulsion of काम: (कामकारतः) – that one (स:) does not attain (अवाप्नोति) success (न सिद्धिम्), nor happiness (न सुखं), nor the supreme Goal (न परां गतिम्).

तस्माच्छास्त्रं प्रमाणं ते कार्याकार्यव्यवस्थितौ। ज्ञात्वा शास्त्रविधानोक्तं कर्म कर्तुमिहार्हसि।।16.24।।

16.24 Therefore (तस्मात्), in determination of (व्यवस्थितौ) what should be done and what should not be done (कार्य-अकार्य), let the शास्त्र be your प्रमाण (ते प्रमाणं). Knowing (ज्ञात्वा) what is enjoined (उक्तं) by the शास्त्र as an injunction (शास्त्र-विधान) , you ought (अर्हसि) to do your (कर्तुम्) कर्म here.

UB: 16:23/24 (1) – Do periodic उपवास, go to तीर्थ स्थान, take care of elders, marry one person only, do नित्य सन्ध्यावन्दन –  our धर्म texts have numerous such rules. भगवान् is asking us to live life as per the rules framed by these texts. If one does not follow these, there is a possibility that काम will drive our कर्म. And the day we break a rule, we may feel emboldened to break another one. Even श्रीरमण used to go around अरूणाचल hill daily and apply विभूति on His forehead, श्रीएकनाथ used to do daily अर्चन, etc or श्रीचंद्रशेखर सरस्वती (कांची शंकराचार्य) used to put himself through intense daily regimen despite being a सिद्ध in an अध्यात्म sense.

UB: 16:23/24 (2) – Why follow rules? After all, are they not man-made? Who are other humans to govern our life?  These are good वितण्ड वाद which are certainly helpful up-to a point. “How dare a government frame traffic rules? How dare a government mandate use of a helmet while driving a bike or use of safety belts in a car?” We do not use such तर्क since we know that these rules are framed for our own safety. तर्क is useful to question a rule and reject it or not follow it at all or follow these to learn and imbibe their spirit. The choice is ours.

UB: 16:23/24 (3) – Rules are not an end game. They are not meant to be adhered to just because some text said so. They are the means to a much higher end of achieving freedom. So follow these daily but keeping the end goal in mind. The daily नियम must be to do नित्यक्रिया mixed simultaneously with स्वाध्याय of the अध्यात्म texts. One has to follow rules to achieve freedom but one who wants freedom from rules is actually getting bound more and more deeply 😊 – this contradiction, if appreciated by one who develops maturity of thought, will make people follow rules in a calm manner.

UB: 16:23/24 (4) – Out of enormous कृपा for ensuring that our human life is not wasted, ऋषि’s have written शास्त्र to help us govern our own life. Thus, if one reads शास्त्र as sympathetic words of an ancient ऋषि, one will not see their words are ‘cruel rules’ but as well-meaning words like that of a loving mother. And following rules of the शास्त्र becomes easy with this mindset as श्रीकृष्ण is imploring us to do.

UB: 16:23/24 (5) – Using कुतर्क and rejecting a rule is अधर्म. Using no तर्क and dumbly following a rule is an expression of तमस् (ritualistic). Using तर्क to reject a rule but impose another discipline aligned to the spirit of the rule is धर्म. Following a rule but with a strong questioning attitude to understand the wisdom behind the rule is also धर्म. It is the last option that creates enormous conflict within the mind that should light up our wisdom. Thus, the one who breaks rules is not a strong person but one who follows it daily despite the inner conflict it creates requires a much higher level of strength. If there is no conflict, there is no learning and thus no expansion.

UB: This last verse brings an interesting challenge from अर्जुन which is the first verse of Chapter 17. Thus ends दैव-असुर संपद् विभाग योग

VN: My problem is that I have known something within myself that no one around knows, and I know the significance of this. I know what it means to be with this or not to be with this. For nothing in the universe would I want to be deprived of what I have within me right now, because this is much more than anything else. I am talking in this context. For someone else, the uncle’s daughter’s friend’s birthday may be more exciting than this. It is unfortunate if your life passes away without knowing the profoundness of your existence. Missing that possibility is tragic. But even to know that something tragic is happening, you need a certain awareness. Millions and millions of people are born and will go through life without knowing anything, and they will die without even a pang of wanting to know. The fact that you are sitting here means you at least had one pang of wanting to know something beyond your limitations. You should not ignore that. That pang, that longing to know is very important and significant. That must be fueled and nurtured. It must become such a longing that you cannot live without knowing. But because you do not know what to do, you have to wait. Whatever you do is wrong. The compassionate Buddha called everyone in the world a fool. Even I think so, but I do not say that because I am in the 21st century. Twenty-five centuries ago, he could say what he wanted. Today, you must be politically correct. Even if the politics are stupid, you have to adjust to it and say utterly idiotic things that do not make any life sense -Sadhguru

UB: I was watching his video when your message came

VN: What a coincidence😊

PK: Interesting way of saying the same thing .., Sadhguru’s  ironic tone appeals a lot ..🙏🙏🙏